Proposal on funds for the Old Spotted Dog Ground

A proposal for the members' meeting on Thursday 20th February 2020

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OllyP
Posts: 1
Joined: 07 Feb 2020, 11:06

Re: Proposal on funds for the Old Spotted Dog Ground

Post by OllyP » 07 Feb 2020, 15:43

shuira wrote:
07 Feb 2020, 13:28
Hi, first of all, sorry for my english, i´m from Argentina. I found the CCFC and i think that it has everything what i expect for a community club, who belongs to their members.
Could you explain me, the OSD has an owner? the owner is Heineken? they arrends it to the CCFC? I try to search info in google but i coudn´t find it.
I saw the pictures, it´s in really bad conditions, but i think it has a lot of potencial, i´m an architect, if you want i could do some renders, or plans if they if they serve for something.
Hey! As I understand it the ground is owned by Heineken through their pub chain. The land is protected from being developed on, so Heineken are looking to a long term lease (100 years?), so CCFC would then be tenants for the next 100 years.
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Caminho
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Joined: 25 Sep 2018, 18:43

Re: Proposal on funds for the Old Spotted Dog Ground

Post by Caminho » 07 Feb 2020, 16:06

I say yes to using our reserves. CCFC as an entire project exists to return us fans to the Old Spotted Dog after all!
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evieg
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Joined: 10 Oct 2018, 21:36

Re: Proposal on funds for the Old Spotted Dog Ground

Post by evieg » 07 Feb 2020, 16:07

dowdinsk wrote:
07 Feb 2020, 12:35
evieg wrote:
07 Feb 2020, 11:23
It's a weird one isn't it? I don't have sympathy for McBean, but everything we've learnt has shown how hard it is/has been to make improvements to the ground, especially if Heineken haven't been contributing anything throughout the entire time. Obviously, Vince had a similar-ish windfall to our merchandise with the increased gate receipts.

Anyway, I fully support this (although I'm completely failing to see what the alternative would be, if we don't make this cash available). My only concern is that the amount is too small.
Originally Clapton's changing rooms were in the warehouse demolished after Heineken parcelled up the site to sell off the land where Upton Heights now stands, and then in the existing warehouse behind the clubhouse. It seems Heineken are perfectly content with the idea that community football can be played in a field without any facilities?
Just the new changing rooms alone improving Heineken's freehold will cost upwards of £75,000 in my view, so there'll be lots more money to find beyond this initial £35,000 to enable the OSDGT to get started with the project.
The covenant on the ground doesn't state that the land is for a football club to play at a particular level, though - they're not obligated (although it's interesting that they'd rather lose out on rental income/security costs than offer any funds for themselves.

Upton Heights is also a converted building, isn't it? It's not a purpose built block of flats. Was it something else after the original changing rooms?

mbriathra
Posts: 2
Joined: 09 Nov 2018, 00:34

Re: Proposal on funds for the Old Spotted Dog Ground

Post by mbriathra » 07 Feb 2020, 17:24

Hello there

I’m writing from Taddiport here in North Devon. I think that the way the club has addressed this difficult issue is testament to its authenticity and the reason why I am so committed.

I’m not in any position to comment on finances other than I believe that when the vote happens it will be the right one when everything has been considered. For me, my heart is in Clapton CFC.

One of the best things I’ve done is becoming a member. I’ll never forget my visit last April for feeling welcome and included, plus a win v London Samurai and great chants!

I think a return to The Old Spotted Dog has to be priority. Given the finances in which you have given worst case scenarios and volunteer support to renovate the ground I’m optimistic.

When the call comes for physical help I’d be prepared to put some hours in and not just be talking about it. No problem to arrange a weekend in London.

Go well with this. Amid the worry of keeping feet on the ground decision making there’s the dream of a return.

Hopefully the negotiations with Heineken are successful and satisfy the needs of the club.

In solidarity

Dave Clinch
Taddiport
Torrington
North Devon

EssexTon
Posts: 1
Joined: 26 Mar 2019, 20:00
Location: Chelmsford

Re: Proposal on funds for the Old Spotted Dog Ground

Post by EssexTon » 07 Feb 2020, 18:01

wansteadton wrote:
07 Feb 2020, 11:52
If the money is there and we need to spend first, to then get Heineken willing to open their purse strings. Then I suggest we go for it. It does seem that the merchandise has given us a huge buffere in terms of revenue and the ultimate goal has been return to the OSD.

Ideally you would like Heineken to be a bit more forthcoming, but it is becoming more apparent that this is not to be the case. So as we have the power and funds to drive this forward ourselves, then I believe this is an appropriate use of the money that has been raised over the past two seasons.
This sums it up nicely for me.

Mouseman
Posts: 1
Joined: 07 Feb 2020, 18:44

Re: Proposal on funds for the Old Spotted Dog Ground

Post by Mouseman » 07 Feb 2020, 19:24

I have a few questions:
1) Did Mcbean have a delaps clause in the CFC lease and if if so isn't he responsible for bringing the ground back to working order?
2) Is there upward only rent reviews in the proposed lease and if so, will any proposed repairs that are carried out then be used as a premise to burden the club with unsustainable rent in the future?
Leaving those questions to one side my general view is that any club needs a ground with security of tenure if they're to get anywhere. The OSD is CCFC's spiritual home and it would be a tragedy to see another London non-league ground laid to waste.Finding another ground that is viable in the long run with be incredibly difficult as-like it or not- the social cleansing of London by the property sharks shows no sign of ending anytime soon.

Bev G
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Joined: 07 Feb 2020, 19:29

Re: Proposal on funds for the Old Spotted Dog Ground

Post by Bev G » 07 Feb 2020, 19:35

The ground is central to CCFC and a worthwhile investment. However, have we explored all opportunities to secure funding from grants and bids? I know I did a funding search about 12 months ago. Happy to do a search for Capital again just in case we can access funding externally and retain some of our reserves.

nathen
Posts: 1
Joined: 27 Sep 2018, 21:40

Re: Proposal on funds for the Old Spotted Dog Ground

Post by nathen » 08 Feb 2020, 01:46

To me there's no option other than to committing the money. Everyone involved on the ground is sensible, organized and devoted enough to make sure things don't go awry with re-development.

Returing to OSD has been the goal for years now. Why else does the money exist if not for this as a huge priority?

If we don't go for it, Red Star could easily lease to another club and then keep us locked out. Leasing from them, committing funds to show devotion to lease/location and also pressuring them to help out though MPs and community is important. Hell, we can even get Heineken on tap if that will appease them somewhat.

Let's not forget that it serves Heineken/Red Star to be on the right side of history here with their vested football interests at the highest level of the game. In a roundabout way, there would be no Champions League if it weren't for teams like CFC/CCFC, and if they want to stay in the good books of the football community and continue to recieve good PR, they will go along. It sounds absurd, but it is true... especially showing the commitment of the Ultras/CCFC fanbase through the last few years and the media attention and connections everyone has.

We should go for it. Continue to be transparent, continue to be sensible, continue to do as much with our own hands as possible to showcase commitment to the community and the history of the land. Doing so can only land ourselves in the good graces of the football community in London and further afield— while getting us back where we want.

Miss you all. Hello from sunny California.
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Copwatcher
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Joined: 25 Sep 2018, 20:59

Re: Proposal on funds for the Old Spotted Dog Ground

Post by Copwatcher » 08 Feb 2020, 11:54

Old Monovian wrote:
07 Feb 2020, 10:52
The corporation tax owed of £18k - is that a one-off or annual bill?
It is the tax on the money we made from the extraordinary sales of our shirts from September 2018 to June 2019. It is very unlikely we will have to pay anything like this again, especially as the legitimate costs of improving the Old Spotted Dog Ground are counted against any future tax bills
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Copwatcher
Posts: 11
Joined: 25 Sep 2018, 20:59

Re: Proposal on funds for the Old Spotted Dog Ground

Post by Copwatcher » 08 Feb 2020, 11:57

shuira wrote:
07 Feb 2020, 13:28
Hi, first of all, sorry for my english, i´m from Argentina. I found the CCFC and i think that it has everything what i expect for a community club, who belongs to their members.
Could you explain me, the OSD has an owner? the owner is Heineken? they arrends it to the CCFC? I try to search info in google but i coudn´t find it.
I saw the pictures, it´s in really bad conditions, but i think it has a lot of potencial, i´m an architect, if you want i could do some renders, or plans if they if they serve for something.
Yes, the Old Spotted Dog Ground has an owner - it's a pub-leasing company called Star Pubs and Bars, which is part of Heineken empire. We are negotiating the terms of a new lease with them.
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